Lathe questions. - The Home Machinist!

Post by Harold_V » Sun Feb 03, 9:23 pm

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sandman wrote:I always thought a mill was easier to learn than a lathe, since you didn't have to worry about the part spinning around and around. After seeing Harold's post, it made me think about it, and I realized that maybe I did things the hard way by learning a mill first. (Figures, lol)
David from jax

It was to your advantage, assuming you learned well. Starting on a lathe allows faster decision making---for two of the dimensions are identical. Once you've mastered those, adding the third dimension (for mill work) isn't very hard. Moving to a lathe after working on a mill allows you to forget that third dimension.

Truth be told, I was in the trade well beyond 10 years before I was comfortable running a mill. I ran them from the outset, but my ability was slow to develop. Mind you, I'm speaking from the perspective of a guy that had to work to rigid specifications and be able to produce work that was acceptable. I could do slop work from the outset. It's tough getting to the point of reliability, where you can mill pockets or step off hole patterns without making scrap, and without the use of any kind of cheat devices (meaning we did not have the luxury of DRO or CNC).

You may not learn tool grinding well when you run a mill, very unlike a lathe. Aside from fly cutting, there are few opportunities to hand grind tools-excepting applying radii to end mills. Those of us that broke in to the trade, prior to CNC and the vast array of insert tooling that's on the market today, had to know how to fashion tools of every description, in almost all cases, free hand. I attribute my considerable skill at grinding HSS to that very thing. I don't know that I have any more ability than others do, but rarely did a day pass that a tool wasn't ground. We were dispensed HSS blanks and brazed carbide tools.. It was up to us to make them work.

Harold

It was to your advantage, assuming you learned well. Starting on a lathe allows faster decision making---for two of the dimensions are identical. Once you've mastered those, adding the third dimension (for mill work) isn't very hard. Moving to a lathe after working on a mill allows you to forget that third dimension.Truth be told, I was in the trade well beyond 10 years before I was comfortable running a mill. I ran them from the outset, but my ability was slow to develop. Mind you, I'm speaking from the perspective of a guy that had to work to rigid specifications and be able to produce work that was acceptable. I could do slop work from the outset. It's tough getting to the point of reliability, where you can mill pockets or step off hole patterns without making scrap, and without the use of any kind of cheat devices (meaning we did not have the luxury of DRO or CNC).You may not learn tool grinding well when you run a mill, very unlike a lathe. Aside from fly cutting, there are few opportunities to hand grind tools-excepting applying radii to end mills. Those of us that broke in to the trade, prior to CNC and the vast array of insert tooling that's on the market today, had to know how to fashion tools of every description, in almost all cases, free hand. I attribute my considerable skill at grinding HSS to that very thing. I don't know that I have any more ability than others do, but rarely did a day pass that a tool wasn't ground. We were dispensed HSS blanks and brazed carbide tools.. It was up to us to make them work.Harold

HEAVYMETAL87 said:

Sorry if any of this seems kind of dumb, I really don't know all that much about CNC- but it does look interesting.

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When on The Hobby Machinist there are no dumb questions. We were all there at one time, we are here to help.

HEAVYMETAL87 said:

I was considering in the future making them where they could be used for both CNC and manual machining if that was possible.

If you want to learn more, please visit our website lathe machining parts cnc.

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Yes, that is very possible and highly recommended. My mill can be operated as a manual machine, or as a 2 axis with manual quill, or as a full 3 or 4 axis. When I CNC my lathe, I will keep full manual capability.

HEAVYMETAL87 said:

What would be the cost of making a basic, three axis CNC milling machine- roughly? I have a computer for it already, and had planned on using servo motors if I go this route.

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I just replaced 4 mill sized servo motors on a CNC router, the parts cost was about $, including all of the cables and a new power supply. Add to this a CNC motion controller and software. Then there is the ball screws to replace the lead screws. I guess I would budget around $ for a 3 axis conversion on a mill. A lathe would be less because it is only 2 axis.

HEAVYMETAL87 said:

Also, is there a way for a CNC machine to check to see if the cutting bit is still viable- so that if it breaks it simply stops trying to make the piece?

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Yes, it's possible, but would require a pretty sophisticated control system. Normally when the tool bit breaks the machine is just ''cutting'' air so no real problem. Really high end machines, $1,000,000 +, have systems that detect broken and dull cutters. This is not normally found on lesser machines. I thought about adding that to my mill, but I don't think it's worth the effort. It would be a lot of programming work and require a lot of experimentation to get it right. A better solution when running the machine ''dark'' (unattended) is to simply to mount a camera near the machine so you can watch the progress on your I-, maybe even with a remote E-stop.

HEAVYMETAL87 said:

Would a fourth axis in the form of a rotary table mounted so that the work piece was horizontal work in lieu of having a CNC lathe?

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In some instances, maybe. I have found that trying to do lathe type work on the 4th axis is not really practical. It is mostly to do with cutter geometry. Consider that a lathe tool bit is more or less a sharp point, where a milling cutter presents a relatively wide flat surface to the work. Each machine is pretty much designed to do a specific type of work. There are high end horizontal machining centers that do both very well, but again you are looking at $1,000,000 + machines.
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When on The Hobby Machinist there are no dumb questions. We were all there at one time, we are here to help.Yes, that is very possible and highly recommended. My mill can be operated as a manual machine, or as a 2 axis with manual quill, or as a full 3 or 4 axis. When I CNC my lathe, I will keep full manual capability.I just replaced 4 mill sized servo motors on a CNC router, the parts cost was about $, including all of the cables and a new power supply. Add to this a CNC motion controller and software. Then there is the ball screws to replace the lead screws. I guess I would budget around $ for a 3 axis conversion on a mill. A lathe would be less because it is only 2 axis.Yes, it's possible, but would require a pretty sophisticated control system. Normally when the tool bit breaks the machine is just ''cutting'' air so no real problem. Really high end machines, $1,000,000 +, have systems that detect broken and dull cutters. This is not normally found on lesser machines. I thought about adding that to my mill, but I don't think it's worth the effort. It would be a lot of programming work and require a lot of experimentation to get it right. A better solution when running the machine ''dark'' (unattended) is to simply to mount a camera near the machine so you can watch the progress on your I-, maybe even with a remote E-stop.In some instances, maybe. I have found that trying to do lathe type work on the 4th axis is not really practical. It is mostly to do with cutter geometry. Consider that a lathe tool bit is more or less a sharp point, where a milling cutter presents a relatively wide flat surface to the work. Each machine is pretty much designed to do a specific type of work. There are high end horizontal machining centers that do both very well, but again you are looking at $1,000,000 + machines.

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